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Nutsy
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Joined: 25 Aug 2016
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Location: Niagara Falls Ont. Canada
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 Posted: Wed Sep 14 16 9:56 pm Post subject: Confused - curing salt |
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Is the use of Pink Salt, Progue Powder, etc only used when you are smoking or drying meats?
It is not used in fresh sausage, am I right in assuming this?
Thanks 
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animal
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| Posted: Thu Sep 15 16 4:23 am Post subject: |
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You are correct, it is a cure and not needed for fresh sausage to be used right away.
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Nutsy
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| Posted: Fri Sep 16 16 7:48 am Post subject: Thanks animal |
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I can lay my mind to rest on that point 
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montanabbq
Joined: 17 Oct 2016
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Location: Billings, MT
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| Posted: Mon Oct 17 16 4:38 am Post subject: Curing salt use |
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Make sure you use Curing salt #1 and not #2.
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Chris Haywood
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Nutsy
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| Posted: Mon Oct 17 16 8:01 am Post subject: |
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Ok thks what dooes # 2 do?
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ComradeQ
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| Posted: Sat Oct 22 16 12:43 am Post subject: |
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| Nutsy wrote: | | Ok thks what dooes # 2 do? |
Cure #2 contains 6.25% sodium nitrite (the same as cure #1) but it ALSO contains 4% sodium nitrate. The difference between sodium nitrite and sodium nitrate is this: sodium nitrite is immediate, it goes to work right away to preserve meat, enhance colour development, and protect the meat from bacteria and toxins such as the deadly botulism spore. Sodium nitrate, on the other hand, does not do anything to preserve or cure meat. All it does is break down slowly into sodium nitrite which does what I previously described above. The difference with sodium nitrite and sodium nitrate is like a time-released pill ... nitrite will work immediately like a regular pill. Nitrate will work slowly like the time-released pill.
So why should this matter? If you are curing something like sausage or bacon, you want the nitrites to go to work quickly to protect the meat since you are curing them over a very short period. If you are curing something like a salami, coppa, or breseola, you want the nitrites to slowly work to preserve the meat through a time-released method as they are long-term cures (several weeks or months). Cure #2 also has sodium nitrite right off the hop so you get the immediate protection plus the time-released protection of the sodium nitrate.
So why can't you use them interchangeably if they both contain sodium nitrite at 6.25%? Well there is a thing called nitrosamines that are produced when excess nitrites have not been used. Nitrites - when broken down in cures - produce nitric oxide (a harmless gas that dissipates away from the meat). If the nitrites have not been broken down then any reaction with secondary amines in an acidic environment (such as a piece of meat being cured; cooking charred and crispy meat/bacon; and the digestion process in a human stomach) will produce nitrosamines and these, my friend, are the nasty carcinogenic chemicals we do not want to consume. If you used cure #2 in your andouille sausage, the residual nitrites from the nitrates breaking down over time would be so high that nitrosomine formation would be dangerous and guaranteed. You do not want to create any more nitrosamines than can be avoided! Also, studies have found that adding vitamin C (sodium ascorbate or just ascorbic acid) will reduce nitrosomine formation by accelerating the breakdown of nitrites into nitric oxide. Many commercial producers are now required by law in some countries to include vitamin C in their cured products for this very reason.
Sorry for the long post! So to summarize:
Cure #1: Short-term cures (bacon, smoked sausage)
Cure #2: Long-term cures (salami, coppa)
No cure: Fresh sausage (if it is being produced to be eaten right away or within a few days) Keep in mind, if the sausage is going to be in the danger zone temperature for a prolonged period of time, it likely needs cure. |
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Nutsy
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| Posted: Sat Oct 22 16 1:04 am Post subject: |
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Please do not apologize for the long post, it was very in formative, and if you dont ask you dont learn.
Great post!
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Nutsy
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| Posted: Sat Jul 15 17 9:34 pm Post subject: Boudin & Cure # 1 |
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I have made boudin a few times and smoked the sausage, I did not use Cure #1.
I recently read a recipe that stated if you smoked the Boudin, it is imperative cure be used.
Is this correct even though the boudin mixture is precooked prior to adding it to natural casings?
Thanks all
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Pit Boss
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Joined: 04 Sep 2008
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| Posted: Sun Jul 16 17 7:48 am Post subject: |
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I'm fairly sure boudin is traditionally not cured.
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Harry Nutczak
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| Posted: Fri Jul 21 17 6:38 am Post subject: Re: Boudin & Cure # 1 |
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| Nutsy wrote: | I have made boudin a few times and smoked the sausage, I did not use Cure #1.
I recently read a recipe that stated if you smoked the Boudin, it is imperative cure be used.
Is this correct even though the boudin mixture is precooked prior to adding it to natural casings?
Thanks all |
Think of cure as an additive to prevent deadly bacteria from growing, (Botulinum) while your sausage is in the perfect environment to grow that bacteria.
Smoking sausage at low temps (40-140) in an environment that has low or no oxygen present for hours and hours is the perfect set up to get C. Botulinum to propagate and produce its deadly spores .
Since you are not smoking, or holding the sausage in such an environment, no cure is required.
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Texas Golfer
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Location: near Houston Texas
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01 17 5:47 am Post subject: Re: Boudin & Cure # 1 |
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| Harry Nutczak wrote: | | Nutsy wrote: | I have made boudin a few times and smoked the sausage, I did not use Cure #1.
I recently read a recipe that stated if you smoked the Boudin, it is imperative cure be used.
Is this correct even though the boudin mixture is precooked prior to adding it to natural casings?
Thanks all |
Think of cure as an additive to prevent deadly bacteria from growing, (Botulinum) while your sausage is in the perfect environment to grow that bacteria.
Smoking sausage at low temps (40-140) in an environment that has low or no oxygen present for hours and hours is the perfect set up to get C. Botulinum to propagate and produce its deadly spores .
Since you are not smoking, or holding the sausage in such an environment, no cure is required. |
I'm reading some older threads to try and learn more about smoking and curing. So here is my question. If the purpose of curing is to prevent deadly bacteria from forming when the meat is in the danger zone, then why do I need cure in my Canadian bacon? It going to brine in the refrigerator, smoke at over 200 degrees, (raising meat temp to over 160) and then store back in the fridge. Does the cure effect the flavor? If not, why can't I just brine with salt? |
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ComradeQ
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Joined: 05 Jul 2012
Posts: 270
Location: Toronto, ON, Canada
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02 17 11:50 pm Post subject: Re: Boudin & Cure # 1 |
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| Texas Golfer wrote: | | Harry Nutczak wrote: | | Nutsy wrote: | I have made boudin a few times and smoked the sausage, I did not use Cure #1.
I recently read a recipe that stated if you smoked the Boudin, it is imperative cure be used.
Is this correct even though the boudin mixture is precooked prior to adding it to natural casings?
Thanks all |
Think of cure as an additive to prevent deadly bacteria from growing, (Botulinum) while your sausage is in the perfect environment to grow that bacteria.
Smoking sausage at low temps (40-140) in an environment that has low or no oxygen present for hours and hours is the perfect set up to get C. Botulinum to propagate and produce its deadly spores .
Since you are not smoking, or holding the sausage in such an environment, no cure is required. |
I'm reading some older threads to try and learn more about smoking and curing. So here is my question. If the purpose of curing is to prevent deadly bacteria from forming when the meat is in the danger zone, then why do I need cure in my Canadian bacon? It going to brine in the refrigerator, smoke at over 200 degrees, (raising meat temp to over 160) and then store back in the fridge. Does the cure effect the flavor? If not, why can't I just brine with salt? |
The cure in this case (hot smoking) is more for flavour development than anything else. You can try curing and not adding a curing salt but your results will be far different than what you are after. The meat will be safe and edible but you will find the loin will taste of pork, like a pork roast, not of bacon. It will also lack the characteristic red hue that a cure brings. |
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